Nora Robarts, aka J. D. Robb, is publishing the 56th book in her In Death series in January. We appear to have reviewed 42 of the Eve Dallas books (!!!), lastly in 2015 when Maggie gave book 41, Devoted In Death, a B.
56 books is about 50 too many for me.
I like series, I do. But, after about six books, I find my attention lags. This is often true even when a series is stellar–I adore Joanna Bourne’s Spymaster series but was perversely content when she stopped at six. I wish Rachel Gibson had left well enough alone and not written a seventh Seattle Chinooks book. I’ve lost some of my enthusiasm for Sherry Thomas’ Lady Sherlock series as well.
I have stuck with a few longish romance series. I read all the Chicago Stars series–it’s two books too long–and all the Lucky Harbors–they all blended together by the last few. I did read and then read again Bec McMasters’ Steampunk series–she broke it into two parts but, really, there are 11. So there’s one long series–it’s no 56 frickin’ books, but still–I enjoyed. But, in general, once the numbers get into two digits, I’m bored.
How about you? Do you love to glom a good long series? And if so, what’s your favorite? If not, what length do you love?
There are a handful of long-running series I really love, although I’m not talking about 50 odd books in each case! I find it hard to believe any author could continue to find fresh plots and situations for her characters after that many books about the same central couple; perhaps because the In Death books are mysteries it gives a bit more scope plot-wise, but I’d think all the relationship development would be well over and done by now – and honestly, I’d probably have moved on not long after that. I’ve read a few series where the stories turned into mysteries after three or four books (Lady Julia, Lady Darby come immediately to mind) because the romance was pretty much done after that many books and I wasn’t interested enough in the mysteries to continue with the series.
The longer series that have worked for me have tended to be romantic suspense ones where the relationship develops over several books. Eden Winters’ Diversion series is nine books, and they’ve all got really interesting plotlines as well as a relationship we can see maturing and throughout. Gregory Ashe’s Hazard and Somerset books now run to 16 in total, but are spilt into three series – 6, 5, 5 – and each has terrific plots and really strong relationship development. Each series focuses on a different aspect of it – the first is about their getting together, the second about adjusting to life as a couple, the third about adjusting when unexpected parenthood – in this case of a troubled teen – explodes into your life. Hailey Turner’s Soulbound series is seven books – the romance is more of a sub-plot, but it’s still absolutely key to the overarching plot. John Wiltshire’s More Heat than the Sun series is also nine books – it’s a bit bonkers and quite dark in places; I wouldn’t rank it up there with H&S or Diversion, but I’m enjoying it.
You already mentioned Bec McMasters London Steampunk series, and although I think Elizabeth Hoyt’s Maiden Lane series was a bit uneven, there were some terrific stories there. I also enjoyed Rachel Grant’s original Evidence series (7 books) – the series got stronger as it went on, and the last four rank among my favourites in the genre. And like you, while I adore Sherry Thomas’ work, I’m starting to want something a bit more… concrete in the Lady Sherlock books, which have started to seem a bit… meandering.
From all that, it seems that around ten seems to be my limit! The series I’m really enjoying right now all look to be around half that – C.S Poe’s Magic and Steam will be five books, her Momento Mori is… I’m not sure, but I think I might have seen… four? Nicky James’ Valor & Doyle series will be four books come January – I suppose in the case of those last two it depends on how many stories the authors can find for those characters to tell, but I can’t see either running into the fifties!
Oh – one exception right now – Cole McCade’s Criminal Intentions series (another same-couple series). He’s structured it like seasons of a TV show, so there are 3 series of 13 books – so far, series 1 and 2 are complete and series 3 is due to be finished next year. I’m almost at the end of S1 and am loving it; not all the books are the same length though, some are like long novellas, others are full-length novels.
In the end, I suppose it’s all down to how many stories the authors can find that aren’t repetitive or don’t have the characters suddenly having personality transplants so they can keep it going. And that’s without getting into the fact that very long series can be intimidating for new readers – especially if they only hear about it when it’s got to book fifteen! I’m sure there are plenty of readers eagerly awaiting In Death #56, but there’s always a danger that some will have left the series by then, and probably won’t be replaced by new readers prepared to start at book one and work their way through. It wojuld have to be something really amazing to keep me hooked for that many books!
I’m hoping the Momemto Mori books go beyond four, and the same with the Valor and Doyle series, but at the same time only if they can maintain the balance of tension and forward momentum in the relationship. After a while it gets tough to maintain an interesting relationship dynamic in established couples without putting them through some fresh hell from outside, which I don’t generally enjoy.
Yes, exactly. I could read about both couples indefinitely, but I wouldn’t ever want to feel that the authors are phoning it in. That said, I can’t imagine either of them doing that, as they’ve clearly taken a great deal of care to craft and tell these stories. I wonder if the upcoming Valor & Doyle book might be the last, seeing as NJ has tied up a lot of the loose ends around Quaid and his family – although I certainly won’t complain if there are more!
I agree with you. I don’t think either of these authors will try to push for stories that aren’t right for the characters they’ve so carefully built. But that won’t stop me from wishing I could get more and more books as well written as those two series.
On the whole, I think that I prefer series to standalones but they have to be well-written, have good character development and no make-weight plots.
I probably enjoy groups of three or four books best, but some authors manage to sustain my interest for much longer!
I used to love Janet Evanovich’s Stephanie Plum books but baled after book 18 when I just got bored at her dithering between Ranger and the other one. I was shocked when I saw that this series is still continuing (Book 29!) Did she ever stop keeping them both dangling?
I got bored with Stephanie’s dithering a lot earlier. I bailed around book 5 or 6. (I also got tired of the “eeps” when she’d see Ranger naked. I mean, really???)
In general, I think six is my limit on series—whether we’re talking romantic-suspense that focuses on a mystery AND the developing relationship between a central couple or a romance series where each book focuses on a different couple from an interrelated group of siblings/friends/ coworkers, etc. Although I’ve read some series that went beyond six books (like the More Heat Than the Sun books that Caz mentions), most of the time after six books (especially if I’m reading other books in between), I lose the thread of what happened in the earlier books unless the author is really good about recapping.
For me, one series that is too long is Stephanie Lauren’s Cynster series. I have tried twice, and only have gotten at far as #10 in the series. Well I really do like the characters, I felt like it was getting repetitive in certain aspects, especially between the development of the relationship between the MCs. There seems to be a formula.
I think you’ve hit my problem on the head.
I get bored with stories that seem the same. A good writer can reboot her themes but in genre fiction that’s much harder to do again and again.
It turns out I really like extended series, but that means I read books in those series that are… adequate. The writers get boxed in. Stephanie Laurens has some good books in the later Cynster titles, but she is clearly challenged by some of the family members she wants to check off.
Rachel Lee’s Conard County books have gone from being a series on an extended family and connections to being a much more random series in a particular setting, so the basic premise of the series has altered. Jayne Ann Krentz does something similar with her sort-of sci-fi paranormals, adding locations and talents to her world in order to keep writing within an increasingly looser framework. Laurens is actually doing something similar to Krentz, leaning heavily into new technologies to source plots for her later Cynster books — they aren’t (and can’t be) Regency ton dramas any more.
The Mischief in Mayfair series by Grace Burrowes is also a redirection of her family and connections approach. (Meanwhile, I am rereading Worth, and finding myself annoyed that Yolanda Kettering and Thomas Hunter never got a book of their own, because the setup for that was pretty clear.)
As noted in the recent discussion of Eloisa James, the Wilde family series just seems to have petered out. The most recent series from Mary Balogh with just one book out, seemed less fresh to me and more labored, as if she needed a new family to plunge into but had to get a novel or two out before she could enjoy this new world of characters. That was not the case with the later book in a series by Stella Riley — Cadenza was wonderful and I loved it.
I am also interested in genealogy and history I think those predilections are part of what drives my tolerance for extended series.
That’s an interesting insight. I’ll have to think about that.
4 is about my limit for any series. The Bridgerton, Bedwyn and Lady Sherlock series all became rather formulaic and no longer interesting. I believe I made it to book 5 of the Flavia de Luce series before I gave up.
I will say with Flavia de Luce, I disliked and did not finish the ones where she traveled to Canada, but recently have picked up several books later in the series and they seem more like the beginning ones.
Three to five would be my sweet spot, although I’ve enjoyed a couple that were longer. Like Caz said below, I stopped reading the Lady Julia and Lady Darby books when they became straight mysteries. The mystery plots weren’t holding my attention. I read 8 of the Mercy Thompson books but none since. I enjoyed 4 or 5 Lucky harbor books, but my interest waned after that, even though the couples changed.
One series I plan on finishing eventually is Lois Masters Bujold’s Vorkosagin sci-fi series. These books are fantastic action/adventure books with great characters. There is no real romance except for Shards of Honor (how Mile’s parents met), Komaar (when Miles meets Ekaterin), and A Civil Campaign (Bujold’s loving nod to regency romance novels about Miles wooing Ekaterin).
I’m 4 books deep into Jordan Castillo Price’s Psycop series on audio and enjoying them. I own all them through book nine already (big Audible sale). The first 4 are pretty short (4-6 hours on audio) so that keeps them feeling fresh, too. Starting with book 5 they are much longer, so I’ll see if that effects how much I enjoy them. Like DiscoDollyDeb, I tend to read books between the series books I’m reading (I’m always in the middle of several series) so keeping details straight gets tricky for me if it goes on too long.
My favorite series recently have been romantic suspense series that follow the same couple and have a slow-burn, complex relationship arc. There is generally a self-contained mystery plot in each book, with the relationship being developed over several. Caz mentioned several series I’m also reading, Like Nicky James’ Valor and Doyle, and two series by C.S. Poe.
You have more romance coming up in Ivan’s book and Gentleman Jole. Shards was the book that made me forget I am a man and read actual romance genre books and Cordelia is still in my Pantheon of Heroines.
Oh good! It’ll be a while before I finish the series, but I will finish. Shards of Honor is one of my favorite books of all time. Talk about enemies to lovers! No one has done it better. That book shows two complex people in a seemingly hopeless situation act like adults and listen to each other. It’s magic.
Some people get disappointed when they read Shards after you recommend it to them as an enemies to lovers book, with no petty hatred involved.
TLDR ever since that happened I have been careful to characterize it as (different sides)enemies-to-lovers
BTW The Spymaster’s Lady should WORK for you with the same individual skill and character, and bone deep respect for each other as Shards.
I guess you’re right about the enemies-to-lovers trope perhaps not being what some expect. They are truly enemies, as in a war, and not people who just dislike each other. That’s why their conversations just wowed me. It’s the only real enemies-to-lovers book I’ve read where you clearly see all the stages of the the relationship, from distrust to eventual love, unfold in such an organic, believable way.
Re: The Spymaster Lady- I’ve read it and I agree!
I really deeply enjoyed – and occasionally reread – Gentleman Jole. It is difficult for Cordelia to find a new life after Aral, and the slow respectful romance of her and Jole is so very well done. A true comfort book for me, myself a widow.
I tend to agree with others who think that three to five books is long enough for a series. I especially dislike when authors crowd the later books in the series with all of the main characters from previous books (looking at you Mary Balogh). It feels forced/distracting, and readers who pick up the series in the middle have no reference as to who the characters are or why they are in the book. I have read some long series and enjoyed most, if not all, of the books in the series. Jo Beverly’s Malloren series was fun, as was Hoyt’s Maiden Lane, and a few others.
One series I’m hoping to see the end of soon is C. S. Harris’s Sebastian St. Cyr series. She’s on at least book 17 and Sebastian still doesn’t know who his real father is. I have not read the latest book in the series yet, the one where he goes to France and is investigating his Mother’s death. I’ve started to see patterns to these mysteries, and that is getting boring even though I’m still surprised by who is the murderer at the end of each book.
Yeah, I bailed on C.S. Harris around 8 books. That’s about my limit in general but I will go a little further if there is an overall plot development. Still I like to see there’s an end in sight. Plus, I would love to see her write something else.
After too many books I find I either get bored or lose track of who’s who. Three to six books seems like a pretty good range (eg Bec McMaster’s Kiss of Steel series was just right for me in terms of the number of individual stories and the overall plot).
Having said that, I was glad of the many many Ice Planet Barbarian books – it feels like there’s dozens of the buggers. I discovered them during a difficult patch and they were fairly quick and easy reads with the right amount of world building and variation between books for interest, coupled with the right amount of familiarity so I didn’t have to think too hard.
Mentioning it slightly hesitantly because it’s not romance, but I do adore the Discworld books – there’s such a range of characters and themes and settings and I love the humour and the depth they hold
Discworld is super fun. I’ve only read three but they’ve all felt like very loosely connected stories.
There are – kind of – three interconnected series that feature a specific set of characters – The Watch, the Witches and Unseen University, and a few books that don’t fit into any thread but which might feature any or all of those characters. It’s possible to read one thread/series of books without reading the others if you want to; you could read all the books about the characters in the Watch, then the Witches, then Unseen University, or you could just read the series in order. It’s been a while since I read them – I keep meaning to revisit some but never get the time!
I love the Discworld books – I’ve read them all but the last 2 or 3. Pratchett had such a wonderful way of looking at the world and could skewer a pertinent issue to within an inch of its life.
A conditional depends-on-the-author thing for me!
I was an avid fan of the In Death books, but the recent ones are just retreads. If it wasn’t such a money-spinner for her, she could have ended it after the Great Big Case. The last two or three have been really tired, and with the last one I found myself going, “Not another child sex ring!” which brings me to another point. There seem to be a lot of thse recently, and they’re not really edifying. Yes, we get it, Eve was an abused child, and I appreciate that it wasn’t as prominent as other books, but can we do something new? It’s getting more obvious that Nora watches a lot of Law and Order SVU, and she even mentions the SVU in her books (which doesn’t exist in RL)
Nora says she will end it when Eve gets pregnant, presumably because her life must change after that. She’ll probably take promotion and stay in the office more.
And Roarke doesn’t seem to do any work any more. I’d really like the central characters to move along a bit.
Anyway, thanks for that. I love long series if they progress, but I do tend to fade out later. For my writing, currently I’m writing in families, and sometimes they’ll link so the in-laws will become the ones in the next book and so on. Since it’s families, they’re rarely longer than 6 or so.
To be fair, the sixth Spymasters book wasn’t the best, the glory of the series is in the books with The Service heroes IMHO.
My feelings exactly.
I have liked series running the gamut of lengths from duologies to 100+ books. As with so many things, the answer is “it depends”.
Scroll down to see where I mention a lot of series I like in this post:
http://www.ccrsdodona.org/markmuse/reading/mostread.html
Scroll down in this post to see several series with my “keep going” or not opinions:
http://www.ccrsdodona.org/markmuse/reading/genrelabels.html
@mark As a data and metadata geek, I’m curious…do you primarily use spreadsheets or the HTML-based lists as your reading log or do you use other tools? Basically, my Q is: Do you maintain the posts/list on the Reading pages of your website manually?
I use Calibre and Bookpedia (although I would like to retire Bookpedia) to track my reading.
BTW The section A Proposed Paranormal Taxonomy in the August 2012 post Expectations, Genre Labels and the Romance Quotient is really great. Maybe due for a 2022 re-vamp (haha)?
Nic:
I started keeping a reading log on paper in 1975. The original motive was to try to REDUCE my time spent rereading at the start of a college year, but it evolved. It was just title & author on the date read (or finished). I typed up that log data in a document (originally Word, currently LibreOffice) years later, and now keep the document up to date. I started keeping more detailed records in a spreadsheet in 2001 or 2002, largely prompted by wanting to keep better data for the AAR annual polls. The spreadsheet columns are: Title, Reread?, Genre+Author, Date read, Sub-genre, Year Pub., Score, Series?, CopyEdits, Formatting, and Publisher. Score is my humor score, only kept for romances. CopyEdits and Formatting were error counts I tracked for a decade from 2005 (results written up at http://www.ccrsdodona.org/markmuse/reading/rightword.html ). Everything on my Musings site is manually edited. Parts of several of the musings were originally written for an earlier generation of AAR message boards. I use Calibre to maintain my master library of ebooks and to convert to epub when needed, but not to track reading.
I’m in awe of all of your manual effort!! I’ve often wondered why I spend so much tracking books read and browsing lists for books to read when I could be reading instead! AAR is helpful in this regard with the monthly “Coming Soon” blog posts. I too am a fan of the annual AAR reading polls. I miss the Top 100 but it makes sense it;s retired. Genres are so diverse and often overlap.
It’s interesting that you reread deliberately. I only do so when experiencing reading blocks.
I also see you appreciate OA/OS. In Calibre you can add records without a file format. The software also allows for custom columns. Unfortunately, it doesn’t have any reporting or analytics features. Maintaining more than two platforms to track reads is a chore.
I agree in general with the 4-5 book range; however, I did enjoy almost all of the Troubleshooters series, which has not been mentioned yet. Given the setup of SEAL teams/FBI and soldiers for hire in different configurations, Suzanne Brockmann had the latitude to change locations and plots drastically, which helped.
I started to feel hectored by those books after Sam and Alyssa’s story. They just stopped clicking for me which was a bummer because I loved them.
Same here.
And they made so many bad choices so often (Sam’s marriage) that I just could not go on. A pity, the early books were extraordinary.
Brockmann’s later works were the first time for me, in reading romance, I began to feel lectured rather than entertained.
Yeah, that was always an issue for me. I’m as pro LGBTQ+ rights as you can be, but I don’t want to be lectured to when I read for pleasure. There’s such a preaching-to-the-choir vibe with Brockmann.
And I did not agree with some of her martyrIc choices. For me, condemning oneself, the potential wife and the baby to horrible unhappiness is not a mature choice, it is obviously buying trouble, big time, long term. Just one example. I am expected to admire the character for doing utterly stupid long term damaging stuff? Did not work for me. YMMV
All over the place with this. Depends on how compelling the characters are and the world-building.
Starting a new-to-me series where there are already more than 8 installments is too much. I consumed Michelle Diener’s Verdant String series in one go because her Class 5 series was so good and I looked into her backlist.
I’ve rated Lisa Kleypas’ Ravenels and Wallflower series all 4/5 or 5/5. Mary Balogh’s Survivor’s Club and Westcott series are great. Agree that Bec McMaster’s London Steampunk and The Bluebloods series are superb—both are finished. Julie Ann Long can continue to publish The Palace of Rogues and I will read them all. Elisa Braden’s Rescued from Ruin series ended at 9 and the majority were good to very good. Another complete and perfect series is Stella Riley’s Rockliffe. Since Julia Quinn’s Bridgerton series is now such a cultural phenomenon, would definitely recommend it.
A unique but excellent series is C.L. Wilson’s Fading Lands at 5 books.
Charlie Adhara’s Big Bad Wolf was a great series and ended with 5 too (I think). Pamela Clare always seems to be on point with every book in any of her series: Colorado High Country and I-Team.
I’m frustrated with In Death and Christine Feehan’s Dark Carpathians. Every other installment is hit-and-miss. Feehan’s Shadow Riders is IMO a perfect series. Great idea, series has an endpoint and then there is a distinct pivot to a new group of characters. Also love Leopard People but IDK for Ghostwalkers (at 18?)—the first 10 were great but now they all seem to blend.
I will read Suzanne Wright’s Dark in You series forever!
Continuing to enjoy the Firebird Chronicles from T.A. White and Alicia Cameron’s Sisters of Castle Fortune series, which are both at 4 books.
Jayne Ann Krentz/JC/AQ Harmony and Arcane series should end. Recent installments seem too repetitive and uninspired. I did not enjoy the 15th release of Nalini Singh’s Guild Hunters series at all–too much focus on peripheral characters; Psy-Changelings/Trinity has lost some of the magic.
Anna Lee Huber’s Lady Darby series could end anytime and that would be totally fine; on the other hand, her Verity Kent series is still compelling. Andrea Penrose’s Wrexford & Sloane, Jennifer Ashley’s Kat Holloway and Sherry Thomas’ Lady Sherlock series all at 6 books are getting more interesting as the H/h relationships are finally maturing.
Ellis Peter’s Cadfael series has 20 installments but each story is unique—could be due to the medieval setting. I would still recommend the Elizabeth Peters Amelia Peabody series to anyone and everyone. Laurie R. King’s Mary Russell and Sherlock Holmes is at 17 (I think). I’ve enjoyed reading this series but not sure I would recommend.
Then there are the long series where the next installment is expected ??? in the future. i.e. Maya Banks KGI for example.
After this post, I’ve realized I’m a series junkie and there is no cure.
You can never love books too much!
Loved the Cadfael series. Tony Hillerman’s Joe Leaphorn and Jim Chee series was great too. I haven’t read any of the books that Hillerman’s daughter wrote that continue the series so I don’t know if they are any good. I think doing a long series is easier if the genre is mystery. But if there is an over arching plot line that continues from book to book, regardless of the genre, the plot line needs to be resolved at some point. Series seem to work best when each book can stand alone and you don’t have to rely on previous books in the series to fill in the back story.
Great insights @kareng!! Maybe it’s the balance of emotional tension and problem-solving that make mystery series so great and have more longevity. Also Brings to mind another great series, Mistress of the Art of Death by Ariana Franklin.
Series continuation posthumous is a whole other discussion. Should they happen? I was OK with The Painted Queen (Amelia Peabody #20) written by Joan Hess for Elizabeth Peters but I can’t bring myself to read Death and the Maiden (Mistress of the Art of Death #5) by Ariana Franklin written by her daughter Samantha Norman—it’s received poor reviews and I would rather end a series on a high than a low.
This is why I like shorter series. I actually do like books that require you to start at the first one and grow with the characters through several books. I’m a big fan of slow burn romances. I think that RS lends itself well to this, having mystery or suspense plots that conclude in each book, but overarching plots and/or relationship development that continues. But as you said, this can’t go on long. That’s why 3 to 5 books feels perfect for me.
Series with different couples often bore me after a few books. That kind of series feels like a string of standalone books, which is fine, but there isn’t a compelling reason to keep reading (for me).
Ooh yes, the Cadfael books are so good. I like seeing the glimpses of other characters lives as the series progresses as well.
It occurs to me that I don’t have the same problem with long-running detective series that I can have with romances, especially if they’re on the less grimdark end of the murdery spectrum. Yes to all the Peter Wimseys! Bring on the Inspector Alleyns! I’ve steamed happily through them all.
I must be the only one who really doesn’t like series. Often, there is a year between books, and I forget characters. I also object to later books in the series having more than just brief visits with previous characters. Sometimes, half the book is taken up with the reappearance, recall of the previous plot (which spoils the original book, if you haven’t read it), the new children, etc. All of these devices detract from the new book. Like all of us, I have some favorite authors whom I reread, but once I begin to see repetition–of plot, word choice, attitude, etc. the author loses her freshness, her ability to surprise and delight. I understand the appeal of series–it’s like meeting someone–male or female–that you really like. You want to spend more time with them. But spending such time often prevents the formation of new attachments.
Do editors look for writers whose books are more likely to be a series because sales figures show more predictable revenue? This may be a chicken-and-egg question—did readers prefer series or did series offerings condition readers?
The U.S. movie business with remakes, series, and an apparently infinite supply of superheroes seem to show a buyer’s predilection for the predictable.
Looking at mythology made me realize just now that humans have been creating long series of related stories for a long time. Zeus and his family and friends are arguably a 50+ story series.
I love that way of looking at stories.
I think series are comforting. You know what you’re getting.
As I noted in another thread, I’ve always loved a long, well-done “epic” or saga. But the authors and the publishing industry figured out quite a while ago they’d rather sell 5 titles in a series than one really long novel. Hence “series” based on a single cast of characters. I’ve read quite a few titles in both the In Death (maybe 18?) and Stephanie Plum (maybe 12?) series, which I thoroughly enjoyed until I didn’t, and gave up on them. My sweet spot for series length is usually in the 3-6 range.
As someone who rereads pretty often, I find it interesting that I generally don’t reread an entire series. One title (maybe two – usually the last in the series) is generally sufficient to remind me of what I enjoyed; e.g. the only Bedwyn books by Balogh I’ve reread are the first and last in the series; and the only Cynster novel I’ve ever reread is the first.
It’s been a long time since I’ve jumped into a series, but the two that I most invested in were J.R. Ward’s Black Dagger Brotherhood vampire books and Suzanne Brockmann’s Troubleshooters Navy SEAL stories. I found that after about book 6 of the BDB, I could no longer stomach Ward’s writer tics. The stories simply weren’t unique enough to overcome my eye-rolling and I ditched it. I did absolutely love Troubleshooters, but once all of the original group of warriors got their stories, I found my interest in newly-introduced characters just wasn’t as strong.
As far as J.D. Robb’s 56 In Death series? Holy cow, I can’t imagine anyone or anything that would keep me interested 56 books worth.